Arabic Part of Daughter/ Son In Your Natal

[Halina]

Forum, I was amazed at the above Arabic Parts and how during child's time of birth you invariably get a transit aspect or a convers transit aspect such as a conj or opp to the Arabic Part of Daughters or to the Arabic Part of Sons.
First, pull up your chart, then in Solar Fire go to Reports, then Arabic Parts and write down your Part of Daughters and your Part of Sons if you have any.   Then in a biwheel put your natal inside and birth of son or daughter in outer wheel.   If your chart was rectified correctly, you should have Part of Daughters or Part of Sons aspecting a trans point.   I tried 5 charts and it never failed to have a trans aspect to these Arabic Parts.   Try it and tell us what aspect you got.

[Barbara Ybarra]

Hi Halina:

I tried it.  I liked it.

What about 2 degrees away?  Both of my sons have planets 2 degrees from my Part of Male Children, one in one direction and one in the other direction.  Now that I think of it, that is sort of perfect (huh?) - they share my "part of male children" space, one on either side of it.  They even give me a bit of breathing room.  I didn't try my husband's chart.  I would assume it would work with father's too.

  My daughter's scenario is more complex.  My part of female children is my Chiron and it is her Neptune/ASC midpoint, or more specifically, it opposes it.  So even though there was not a transit to it, the transits flanked the part of female children, exactly. She has always been quite concerned, even as a child, with things going on with her body.  Neptune hugs her Ascendant, and that usually suggests an unclear perception of health.   Mysterious illnesses take their toll on her fairly regularly.  Very interesting.

I want to thank you very much for pointing out this gem of information.  I'm sure it will come in useful someday.

Barbara Ybarra   

[Barbara Ybarra]

Halina!!

I just checked out my husband's chart.  When our daughter was born, tr Uranus squared his part of daughter exactly.  When son number one was born, the Sun/Moon midpoint was exactly on his part of son point.  When son number two was born, tr Pluto was exactly square to his part of son.

I wonder what else we can say about that.  Obviously, what my sons and daughters mean to me, is not the same thing that they mean to my husband.

Pretty awesome stuff.

Barbara Y

[Halina]

Barb and Starshine, Awesome connections.  Don't forget to to converse transits, you might get even more hits.  Go to Transits in Solar Fire and click in the circle for converse.  Then type in your son or daughter's birthdate and set up a biwheel.  Guaranteed you'll get more hits.  Tell us about them.  And thank you for your feedback.              HALINA

[Jessica]

What's the formula for these parts? Does the AM/PM thing come into play? I know that's how they're used sometimes.

[Don Borkowski]

Jessica,

When the formulas for Arabic Parts refer to daytime births and nighttime births, it does not mean a.m. versus p.m.  Rather, a daytime birth is one where the Sun is in the top half of the chart, and a nighttime chart is one where the Sun is below the horizon.

Don

[Barbara Ybarra]

Hi Zarathu:

Not sure what your question means, but perhaps I didn't word my sentence as well as I would like to have.  I didn't mean to imply that my husband and I had different levels of love for our children, just that our role as parents take on different intentions or realms of experience, as it always does.  I used the word "obviously", not because we had different planetary energies being expressed by the transits and that birth (or as a judgement of it) but because people always do have different expectations as to what parenthood will mean to them.  Also, as parents we may be bringing in people that we need to settle karmic dramas with.  In my own case, both of my sons have explicit karmic connections to me (shown by the Moon Nodes and planetary placements), whereas my daughter has closer karmic connections to my husband, her father.

I used Arabic parts a long time ago in consultations, usually in relation to sickness or surgery, and in suggesting the use of the Part of Fortune placement and sign for a "down time" activity for those under lots of stress.  I also got a little obsessed with my Part of Death for awhile, suspecting that it was attached to air travel accidents.   

Anyway, I am enjoying the additional usage of these spots once again.  I wouldn't start out using Arabic Parts while studying a chart, but when a little more is required, what an awesome tool.  I noticed that my husband and I both have the same degree for Part of Marriage.  I may have seen it before, and probably thought "Oh, well, of course we do."  But how cool is that?  I checked our marriage date and the Moon Node was square to that point at the time (rather closely).  In a sense, we are definitely not just married to each other, but to the "village" as they say.  It takes a village to keep a marriage healthy.  In times of trouble, we never had interference from family or friends over what to do or not to do, but we certainly had lots of comforting support.  Everyone hoped we would stay together.

Thanks for the question.  Did I answer it?

Barbara Ybarra

[Don Borkowski]

I had written a response to this topic, and it got lost when someone else posted while I was typing.  

First of all, I do not have Solar Fire.  I do enjoy the insight that Arabic parts can add to a chart.  My most poignant example involves how my 2001 solar return chart showed the abrupt end of my marriage.  I found that by adding Arabic Parts to the SR chart, I was able to ascertain (correctly) whether the marriage would end in divorce or death and who would file or pass away.

I got most of my formulas for Arabic Parts from the venerable A to Z Horoscope Maker and Delineator.  I've found more in other sources and even invented one of my own back in 1974, which is now an accepted part of the literature.

The A to Z referred to the Parts of Male Children and Female Children, rather than to sons or daughters.  The implied difference is that not all male children are one's sons, etc.  In fact it would be very interesting to see where this part would fit in the horoscope of a priest who sexually molested altar boys.

The formulas given in the A to Z are:
Male Children:  Asc. + Jupiter - Moon;
Female Children:  Asc. + Venus - Moon.

Don

[sunflower]

Halina,

Part of  Sons = conj N Node within a degree! I have 3 sons!

sunflower   

[Barbara Ybarra]

Hi.

This is to Zarathu especially.  It's half-time and Springsteen is singing, but I'm recording it, and I usually multi-task anyway.  What you are asking is pretty specific and detailed and I'm not sure anyone would be interested overmuch in my own little world, but as an example of my thinking process on this I will give son number one.

 To my own Part of Son, Pluto came inside of 2 degrees conjunct to that point at his birth.  That particular son of mine has been a transformative influence in my life in ways that I cannot even begin to describe here.  In fact, I am writing a little book on it.  In his relationship with me, he has continually flipped my perception of life on it's head.

  In the case of my husband, his Part of Son was met by the Sun/Moon midpoint at the time of our son's birth.  That to me is a perfect picture of simple procreation.  That son is the product of a marriage, the creative outcome of a union with a woman (me).  In a way, that first born son has always been that to him, starting from day one when he watched him come out of my womb, not knowing that he was a boy, and saying that it didn't matter if he was a boy or a girl, but practically falling on top of me in relief when a boy was born because he wanted one so badly.  He got his boy.  It's not a shallow relationship, but the basis I believe is strongly ego oriented....the proud father of a healthy boy.

I don't feel compelled to look at asteroids, houses, or even signs.  The fact that the Part of Son is associated with those planets is a powerful enough statement for me.  That's not to say that there wouldn't be more to look at, it's just all that I care to do at this time.  Besides, I'm watching the Superbowl.

Barbara Ybarra 

[Allanah]

Hello all, terrific posts, really interesting.  Can someone tell me if the Arabic Parts are progressed or do they always remain as in the natal chart.
If they are progress, what is the effect  ie how might  they work ?

Don Bowkowski, could you please elaborate on your SR chart and how you were able to see the end of a marriage using the Arabic Parts.
I realize that this is personal info and if you are uncomfortable with my question  could you just generalie so that I can get the idea. 
  Regards,  Allanah

[Don Borkowski]

Allanah:

I've sent you my little monograph on solar returns.  Basically, my Solar return for 2001 had the Sun in the 4th house, ruling the 4th house in opposition to Uranus in the 10th, ruling the 10th.  There were other aspects that suggested the end of the marriage.  It was necessary to calculate the Part of Divorce and the Part of Death.  Then it was fairly easy to see that my wife might die--and she did.

Don

[Halina]

More Awesome Stuff:  The 2 most workable Parts of Marrriage Formulas are: Asc + 7th -Venus (for male or female) and
Asc + Saturn - Venus (Marriage of Women) or Asc + Venus - Saturn (Men's Marriage).   Saturn formula gives stability in Marrriage.
    Frank Sinatra's Part of Marriage = 27Aries55
Married Nancy Barbato, c.s.a Moon = 27Aries30 on Feb4 1939
Married Ava Gardner      d.s.a Jupiter= 26Aries27 on 7Nov 1957
Proposed Marriage to Lauren BaCall  c. tr. Neptune = 28Aries07 on Mar11 1958
Married Miss Farrow  d.s.a. Moon = 26Aries44 on July19 1966

   Forum, please recheck your marriage dates with these 2 formulas for men and women.  And let's hear some awesome stuff!!!

[Don Borkowski]

What do you mean by d.s.a. and c.s.a.?

DB

[Halina]

Yes Don,  D.S.A. means you direct or solar arc the chart the normal way by typing in date, etc and hi-lighting Solar Arc.
Converse Solar Arc means you check the circle that says "converse" after choosing Solar Arc and filling out the date and location of the event as for d.s.a.       O.K?